Porsche in NASCAR

[SDKmann]

I was reading a copy of exelence magazine on my way to Road America friday and found a very disturbing article. It was about Porsche racing 911s in NASCAR in the late 60s. Then it went from terrible to unthinkable. A few pages later there was a one page article on Porsches future in NASCAR. Porsche is planning to race thier new Panamerica sedan in NASCAR. They say that this is because they want to have the marketing opportunity that Toyota and American cars have. In a different article in a different magazine Porsche said it was making the panamerica sedan to get away from the bad image created by the Cayenne SUV. I think they are making thier image a thousand times worse by feeding money into the panamerica instead of a new supercar (This info also came from Porsche), and then racing in NASCAR. I was raised on BMWs and Porshce and is that is the reason I own a BMW and want a Porsche. I find this awful and a huge mistake by Porsche.

[DustenT]

NASCAR is the second most popular "sport" in the nation, next to football. Do you understand the amount of exposure that give a sponsor? Seems like a good business move to me.

[aceyx]

Panamera sedan. Panamerica is a different car.

Should Porsche get into NASCAR? No, but not because of my (admittedly) elitist attitude. You get into racing as a promotional/research adventure, not because you just have a lot of cash to burn.

Will NASCAR fans go out and buy Porsches after seeing them get killed on the track? Probably not, so why put the money in there? Do you think current owners are going to look at their Euro imports and see a bunch of slack-jawed yokels staring back at them through the glass? Probably.

I hope they're not serious, more because I think a shareholder suit will destroy Porsche (because it's that stupid a move on their part).


If it helps, BMW, Porsche and Illien (McLaren-Mercedes engine builders) might have bikes in MotoGP beginning next year.

[GDB]

Would it be better if they raced F1? Since that's such a technoligically advanced racing series :rolleyes:

[JPerfect]

Yeah, Nascar really isn't the right demographic for Porsche in my opinion.

[3DGE]

I am all for it, I would like to see some euro cars beat the crapy us cars! I dont watch nascar, i like F1 better!

[JPerfect]

Sure, I'd love to see the competitiveness, but I mean from a business sense... People who are into NASCAR are into American Muscle... for the most part. Though Euro cars might bring a new crowd in... However I don't think "All-Americans" would like that very much.

[SDKmann]

NASCAR is the second most popular "sport" in the nation, next to football. Do you understand the amount of exposure that give a sponsor? Seems like a good business move to me.
Yeah but you have to pick the right place to advertise. Advertising Porsches in NASCAR is like advertising Hummers at an environmentalist convention.

[aceyx]

I am all for it, I would like to see some euro cars beat the crapy us cars! I dont watch nascar, i like F1 better!
I really feel that Porsche would get absolutely trounced in this arena. Everybody else has so much experience on set-up, and because of the rules a lot of it relies on the driver.

[DustenT]

Yeah but you have to pick the right place to advertise. Advertising Porsches in NASCAR is like advertising Hummers at an environmentalist convention.

I admit that I don't know much about Marketing, but this topic made me wonder who the average NASCAR fan is. BTW - I have many wealthy friends/family that enjoy NASCAR (none drive Porsche, but all could afford to).

http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=476206

This is directly from NASCAR:

Below you will find the results of my research regarding the
demographics of NASCAR fans.

NASCAR FANS

Gender distribution
Male 60%
Female 40%

Age distribution
U.S. pop. NASCAR fans
18-34 32% 32%
35-44 21% 26%
45+ 47% 43%

Income distribution
U.S. pop. NASCAR fans
$30-50,000 22% 29%
$50-75,000 18% 22%
$75-100,000 12% 12%
$100,000+ 9% 8%

Regional distribution
U.S. pop. NASCAR fans
Northeast 20% 20%
Midwest 23% 24%
South 35% 38%
West 21% 19%

Ethnic diversity
% of NASCAR fan base (18+):
1999 2002 Trend
Hispanic 3.6% 8.6% +139%
African-American 4.9% 9.1% +86%
Source: NASCAR

Residence
Rent 28%
Own 72%

Employment
Full Time 72%
Part Time 10%
Retired/Unemployed 18%

72% of NASCAR fans own their own homes and work full-time and 38% are college grads, seems like the kind of people that might be interested in driving a nice car.

NASCAR = high speed driving. Porsche makes cars that can be driven fast. I hate to be the one to say this, but don't you think Porsche knows better than we do? Are any of you in automotive marketing? What makes you more qualified than Porsche huge marketing division?

[aceyx]

I'm wondering if they're going to bid for JP Montoya.

[mohaughn]

And maybe he can wreck his car in the first lap like he usually does...

Is porsche were to do this with a new car, they would most certainly need an experienced nascar driver, as well as an experienced nascar team.

NASCAR has been trying very hard, and doing a good job, of losing the uneducated redneck stigma that they picked up in the 80's.

[GDB]

I am kinda interested to see how they make a nascar look like anything from porsche's lineup.

[jdehaan]

is this for serious, or is it just a rumor? I would be honestly surprised if they did go through with it, since they spend so much on so many other forms of racing. I dont think they are getting involved in F1 because of it being such a massive money pit. I mean in order to be even close to competetive you have to have a $500 million budget. and even then you are only competing against a few other teams. I think they would much rather spend their money on other forms of racing that have a larger base to compete against. I do wish they would take the plunge and get into F1 though. That would be awesome.

[pdxmotorhead]

I suspect Porsche wants to be involved in a venue
that americans watch, since the bulk of their production cars
come here..... F1 is not very important viewer wise in
the US (We don't get the broadcasts outside of cable..)
Compared to just about any other race venue there are more
nascar broadcasts and better coverage.

They have almost no development work to do, the chassis
are all so restricted it boils down to the crew chief's ability
to read the track and interpret the drivers input.

They would also need a cam in block engine....
I would like to see how many laps a Porsche marked
vehicle would make on a typical start, you may as well
have a bullseye on the back bumper... :biggrin:

Dave

[andy]

I am kinda interested to see how they make a nascar look like anything from porsche's lineup.

That's the problem, IMHO with NASCAR... Root for Ford or Chevy if you're a Ford or Chevy man, but there's nothing at all in common with the cars on the track that you can acually buy. Some of the coolest NASCAR racing happened at a time in the 60s and 70s when the racing rules acutally did influence the cars that were on the street. It's just a spec race now.

Porsche could make a cam-in-block engine, sure. Toyota had to design an all-new one when then went into NASCAR Trucks because they didn't have one either.

It seems like an interesting move to me...marketing opportunities aside there does seem to be something odd about this arrangement... :o

[Etienne]

Speaking from a purely reactionary standpoint...I find it a bid strange, and strangely disapointing/disilusioning. You have to imagine that the idea-men for Porsche have some idea what they are doing (insert Manatee Family Guy clip from South Park here for comic effect). I guess its kind of like America in the World Cup -- some people get angry, some people laugh, other people get WAAAAY to excited, but at the end of the day it gets Americans watching soccer and seeing lots and lots of advertisements and buying a ton of adidas shwag. Die-hard NASCAR fans are not going to touch a porsche, but there are a lot of people who aren't diehard NASCAR fans yet.

I dunno... my $.02

[andrew318ti]

Nascar is fun to watch at the track, but seeing cars go in a circle lap after lap gets boring. from what i understand everyone in nascar has to use almost the same chassis, an in block cam engine and carbs.
whats a porsche with carbed ohv v8 engine, live axle rear end, and a very outdated chassis( i'm not saying they dont get good handling numbers out of them but it could use some serious updating or a complete new design)

something that goes against what porsche has been doing for decades.
technology is how porsche has always been ahead of the game, without use of its normal suspension building techiques and modern engine management/fuel injection, its NOT a porsche. has porsche EVER had a live axle rear end(i honestly am not sure, but i doubt it) even the 356 was independent. i dont know why porsche is even considering doing this, but they have the wrong people running the company.
it will ruin their reputation, make them look stupid, and why? to make more money? this could very well be the beginning of the end for porsche if they go ahead and do this.:frown:

[3DGE]

HAHA nascar is gay, all they do is drive in a circle for 2 hours.

[S10mafia50]

I wish the rolex and american lemans series were on regular channels or the basical sattilite channels.....I honestly prefer the sports car racing over nascar, and I would be amazed if porsche does build a carbed single cam in block engine to compete with....lol. If I were them, I'd try to change rules to allow them at least a DOHC engine....They should be allowed to run the flat 6 against the american v8's......lol. Yes, this would be a huge market for them to enter, but sounds like a heck of alot of work. I think the panamerica sedan must be built in the USA for it to be allowed in, and that would equal one heck of a car, along with more jobs....And more people going to the few porsche dealers out there....
Andrew

[michaelhofastcar]

This is as laughable as seeing Herbie the Beetle racing NASCAR in last year's movie. Herbie also has a rear engine like a 911.

[SDKmann]

This is as laughable as seeing Herbie the Beetle racing NASCAR in last year's movie. Herbie also has a rear engine like a 911.
The car porsche will be racing is front engined. Porsche will kill its self doing this. First SUVs, then a sedan, and now this? Whats next, a porsche ecno hatch called the 911ti?:rolleyes: Just kidding.

[S10mafia50]

I can respect porsche for building the suv.....they are showing they want to be a larger company and provide thier racing experience to a much more valuable market.....If they build a good sedan, market it right, and make it affordable to most people, how can they lose. Porshe is just showing that since they have their best sports cars ever, the 997 and cayman, and are still trying to make more. If companies didn't take risks, would you honestly expect any of them to be a big company?
Andrew

[SDKmann]

The thing about porsche is that they were a purist sports car company before. Money that would have gone into racing development went into the cayenne and money that was for a new supercar went into this new sedan. Both the SUV and sedan have taken away from porsches purist sports car image and have taken money away from things that really matter. If I were some rich soccer mom the idea of a porsche sedan and SUV would be great, but from a auto enthusiast point of view these as the beginning of the end for porsche.

[IndianaTravis]

First, IF they went to Nascar, they wouldn't actually be racing the Panamerica. they'd be racing the "Car of Tomorrow" which is a common Nascar tube frame vehicle with different stickers for each manufacturer to simulate the looks of the grill, lights, etc.

Second, they would have to develop and build a pushrod V8, which would shock me if they would do.

Third, nothing about Nascar fits in Porche's core image. Porche has always raced the vehicles they built, and used the racing to improve the vehicles. Nascar (which is a spec series) has nothing to do with this.

Add in thier involvement in ALMS and Grand Am here in the states, and I see NO WAY we'll ever see a specialty manufacturer like Porche in NASCAR. Now, they may choose to run the Panamerica in one of the higher GT classes, possibly against the Corvettes and Aston Martins in ALMS, which would give them competitive cars in 3 of the 4 classes, while not having to go head to head with Audi.

[pdxmotorhead]

FYI Porsche makes only a minor profit on their car line.
They make HUGE money on their patent liscensing.

They have the largest Chassis dyno in the world,
they did the suspention on machines like the Freightliner
Tractor, and the Abrahms Tank. 27 tons at 60 MPH with
a big herking gun..... Wahooo...

Dave

[Etienne]

I think this has been mentioned before, but I think the car we are talking about is the Porsche Panamera, right?