Steering wheel shakes @ 40 MPH

[L84THSKY]

As I have mentioned recently, I've installed rims and tires on my car. The one odd thing is this little shaking the steering wheel does @ about 40MPH. This wasn't happening with the original wheels I had just removed. It doesn't do it above or below this speed. The tire shop that installed my rims and tires said one of my rims is out of round. I plan to exchange that rim soon, but want to be sure what is causing the problem. The rim that has a problem was moved from the front right, to thr rear right, and the problem didn't really go away.

A friend of mine said that the extra weight of the rims might cause the problem. He said that there are steering dampers that might be causing the problem due to the extra weight.

I plan on swapping the original wheels in the front, and driving it for awhile, to see if the wobble goes away. Then I can determine that the problem was with the front wheels. I still won't know if it's the weight issue, or if the front wheels have problems.

I hate when one shop blames the parts or work from another shop/supplier. If it is a balance issue, then I want the tire shop to own up and fix it.

One final point, if the wheel is out of round, shouldn't a wheel balance compensate for this problem, atleast if the wheel isn't too bad?

[pdxmotorhead]

BMW's use Hub centric rims.
Honda's have a similar problem.
I'm sure there are others.

Good tire shops have some little widgets made of plastic called hub centrics
that go on your hub to act as a center/shim to fill in the difference between
your hub diameter and the diameter of the wheel center hole. Otherwise
you can end up with the wheel being offset a few thousands and it will
vibrate or rumble.

Good Luck
Dave

[96cali]

I've always been told that out of round cannot be fixed. Maybe masked, but the tire will rumble and deteriorate faster.

[AutoM3otives]

steering dampner might have gone out.

also, on my old 190e, I had plus size wheels/tires and crossdrilled rotors. braking from above 60mph would cause the steering wheel to shake alot. this was due to warped rotors. don't know if its the same thing as your situation but maybe that'll help.

[L84THSKY]

Hey Dave

I like your answer :)

The rims did come with these 4 orange plastic rings, but I didn't have them put on. Maybe that is the problem. The tire shop said I might need them, after I explained I had them.

That is easy enough to check, they will put them on for free.

As for the rim, seems replacing might be hard. The exchange rate has hurt imports on European rims. I'm not even sure the original retailer carries this brand anymore.

Thanks
Eric


BMW's use Hub centric rims.
Honda's have a similar problem.
I'm sure there are others.

Good tire shops have some little widgets made of plastic called hub centrics
that go on your hub to act as a center/shim to fill in the difference between
your hub diameter and the diameter of the wheel center hole. Otherwise
you can end up with the wheel being offset a few thousands and it will
vibrate or rumble.

Good Luck
Dave

[L84THSKY]

What do you mean steering dampner gone out? The wheels I had on the car previously where OEM 15" rims. This problem was not happening with them. Could the steering dampner have "gone out" because of the new rims/tires?

steering dampner might have gone out.

also, on my old 190e, I had plus size wheels/tires and crossdrilled rotors. braking from above 60mph would cause the steering wheel to shake alot. this was due to warped rotors. don't know if its the same thing as your situation but maybe that'll help.

[city]

Are the rims new or used? If they are used you may have a bent rim.

[L84THSKY]

Rims were brand new in the box. Tires were used Dunlop Sport 8000 235/45/17.

Are the rims new or used? If they are used you may have a bent rim.

[pdxmotorhead]

You might ask how the tire shop knows they are out of round,
If they spun them on your car and they weren't centered on
the hub they would wobble as if out of round. I would see if they
can take the tire off and do a runout test on the rim.

You might have notice my side not about honda's having this problem.
we went through two sets of rims at the shop, thinking they weren't
tru or out of round. My wife was chasing the problem and asked the guy
why you couldn't see the rims wobble on the balancer but you could on the car.

There were some red faces at the shop when they figured it out...
My wife was pretty pleased with herself....

Dave

[L84THSKY]

What actually happened was, he said he noticed when balancing the wheel, it was out of round. He showed me by putting the wheel on the tire balancer, and seeing the rim wabble when spun slowly.

But this begs the question. If he was to put the shim on the so called "out of round" rim, then put it on the wheel balancer, would I have seen the wabble?

Should wheels be balanced on the wheel balancer with or without the shims?


You might ask how the tire shop knows they are out of round,
If they spun them on your car and they weren't centered on
the hub they would wobble as if out of round. I would see if they
can take the tire off and do a runout test on the rim.

You might have notice my side not about honda's having this problem.
we went through two sets of rims at the shop, thinking they weren't
tru or out of round. My wife was chasing the problem and asked the guy
why you couldn't see the rims wobble on the balancer but you could on the car.

There were some red faces at the shop when they figured it out...
My wife was pretty pleased with herself....

Dave

[sKunkman]

You might ask how the tire shop knows they are out of round,
If they spun them on your car and they weren't centered on
the hub they would wobble as if out of round. I would see if they
can take the tire off and do a runout test on the rim.

You might have notice my side not about honda's having this problem.
we went through two sets of rims at the shop, thinking they weren't
tru or out of round. My wife was chasing the problem and asked the guy
why you couldn't see the rims wobble on the balancer but you could on the car.

There were some red faces at the shop when they figured it out...
My wife was pretty pleased with herself....

Dave

What was the problem/solution?

[pdxmotorhead]

I'd make sure the balancer is a hub centric balancer, some use a
mechanism that centers on the lugs, you shouldn't need the shims
on the balancer, usually they use cone shaped centering anvils
to make sure the rim is centered. Assuming that it does , it sounds
like the rims are out of true....

How old are the rims? I'd expect warrantee coverage if they are new.

Good luck...

Dave

[pdxmotorhead]

What was the problem/solution?

They put the plastic shims on the hubs and installed the wheels.
Smooth as silk after that.

Funny thing was all the technicians knew about the problem with
the hondas and all of them involved missed that they weren't used.

Just a case of mass forgetfulness....

Dave

[bmw///m3///]

my cars steering wheel shacked at 40 mph, mech said it was the lf balljoint getting some play in it. it eventually make my tire unbalanced after not fixing it.

[dodj]

I had the same problem. A wheel balance and allignment fixed the problem. Also, make sure your tyres are always at the recommended PSI.

[L84THSKY]

I called the tire shop, they are gonna put the shims in tomorrow, before I go to work. I'm confident that is the problem.





They put the plastic shims on the hubs and installed the wheels.
Smooth as silk after that.

Funny thing was all the technicians knew about the problem with
the hondas and all of them involved missed that they weren't used.

Just a case of mass forgetfulness....

Dave

[pdxmotorhead]

I ought to mention one other thing about the shims.

ALWAYS watch if you have the car in a shop for work
requiring wheel removal. 2 times I caught guys throwing them away
when they fell on the floor and the "mechanic" started to pitch them,
only the straight up tire shops seem to be aware of what they are.

Dave

[cali-ti]

can someone post a pic of these plastic shims? maybe even next to the rim or hub so we can get an idea of size, etc? thanks in advance :)

[L84THSKY]

You da man :2gun:

Put the shims in this morning, all fixed, rides smooth as silk.
The Manager was embarassed, he should have known better :biggrin:


They put the plastic shims on the hubs and installed the wheels.
Smooth as silk after that.

Funny thing was all the technicians knew about the problem with
the hondas and all of them involved missed that they weren't used.

Just a case of mass forgetfulness....

Dave

[L84THSKY]

I would have taken a picture, didn't see this message till now. :blink:

can someone post a pic of these plastic shims? maybe even next to the rim or hub so we can get an idea of size, etc? thanks in advance :)

[pdxmotorhead]

Glad that did it... :icon_clap


They are just plastic rings that go on the hub center
and the wheel slips over them.
Look like they cost 50 cents.... Look like they are
made of delrin usually white or orange.
(I think the orange ones are made of PVC)

Dave

[L84THSKY]

Mine were orange. Who would believe that some plastic rings could make all the difference. :?

Glad that did it... :icon_clap


They are just plastic rings that go on the hub center
and the wheel slips over them.
Look like they cost 50 cents.... Look like they are
made of delrin usually white or orange.
(I think the orange ones are made of PVC)

Dave

[cali-ti]

good catch pdx! nice when a fix is cheap for once :)

so, if your rim's center hole is tight against the hub center, you wouldn't need a shim, right? just making sure i understand everything. i guess that would explain why i never had any shims. the stock rims appear to fit on tightly over the center and thus have no need for the little filler/shim.

L8, if you think of it, next time you have a wheel off, snap a pic and post it. thanks!

[pdxmotorhead]

good catch pdx! nice when a fix is cheap for once :)

so, if your rim's center hole is tight against the hub center, you wouldn't need a shim, right? just making sure i understand everything. i guess that would explain why i never had any shims. the stock rims appear to fit on tightly over the center and thus have no need for the little filler/shim.

L8, if you think of it, next time you have a wheel off, snap a pic and post it. thanks!

Thats right. The stock rims fit TIGHT at least on my car you have to
yank them off. My jeep is the same way (But I made it that way) Because
it takes load off the studs. They only have to hold the wheel on and the
weight is held by the much stronger wheel center and axle hub.

Glad ot worked...

Dave.

[cali-ti]

makes sense. thanks for the explanation pdx. i'm sure i'll learn more from you in the future :)

[pdxmotorhead]

Usually right after I've had to put it back together.... ;)

:D

Dave

[cali-ti]

someone has to go through the pain first ... and will hopefully share what they've learned with the rest of us. i for one appreciate all those who post what they've learned here. finding it can become a chore, but at least it's there ... somewhere :) between here and the yahoo 318ti mailing list, there's usually someone who has done it before and will provide advice. it's really handy ... steven has built a nice community here (thanks steven!).