318ti.org forum - Track ti build (M52)

318ti.org forum (http://www.318ti.org/forum/index.php)

- Engine Swaps (http://www.318ti.org/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=26)

- - Track ti build (M52) (http://www.318ti.org/forum/showthread.php?t=42351)

Time to change your signature Dave to a 328ti. :) Nicely done. :cool:

Kind of late to the thread, but good to see the wheels being put to good use! From canyon to track, where it belongs!

Nice with the swap too! Good work!

Quote:

Originally Posted by spidertri (Post 380924)

The last thing on my checklist before I attempted to start the car was installing a SPAL fan. I chose the 16" medium profile puller fan. It fit nicely on the radiator with plenty of room to clear the water pump.

https://c3.staticflickr.com/8/7592/2...dc3e84d9_h.jpg

Here's a shot of my mount idea. I wanted to keep it easy to remove in case I needed to work on something at the track.

https://c5.staticflickr.com/8/7360/2...2642733c_h.jpg

The primary support is the lower 1/8" aluminum. This strip easily supports the weight of the fan and fits in the tabs for the stock fan shroud. Then the brackets on top hook over the radiator but are there as more of a backup in case something happens and the lower mount were to fail. Two screws into the upper radiator lip keeps it in contact with the radiator core.

To wire it, I cut the connector off the stock aux fan (my fan was all busted up so I didn't feel too bad) with a few inches of the stock 3-wires. The SPAL fan only has one speed so I twisted the high and low speed wires together on the factory connector and crimped them to the power wire on the SPAL wiring. Then just connected the ground wires together. This way the fan can be unplugged and easily removed.

One of the discrepancies in the engine harnesses makes it so that the normal aux fan speed will not work with the M52 engine harness. This is because on the M52 cars the double temp switch goes to the relays and then to the DME. On the M44 cars the double temp switch goes to the DME before heading to the normal speed relay. Without updating the chassis-side wiring the normal fan speed will not come on automatically in a M/S52 swap.

However, on both M44 and M52 configurations the double temp switch goes directly to the high speed relay. Stock M52 double temp switch is 91/99C and the M44 switch is 81/88C. So by using the M44 double temp switch and not touching the chassis-side wiring my SPAL will turn on at 88C, lower than the factory M52 setting.

Since doing this I have run the car and let it idle long enough to kick the fan on. By only wiring up the SPAL through the stock AUX connector and using the M44 double temp switch my fan kicks on and lowers the radiator temperature just as the stock fan would. The only difference is that my SPAL only has one speed. So it comes on at the "high" temp of 88C on the exit side of the radiator.

Quoting this as it is very good information...

Quote:

Originally Posted by spidertri (Post 381311)

That's good to hear, I had to add the pilot bearing since the donor motor was attached to an automatic, pilot bearing is the same size for all e36 motors I believe.

Awesome James, I'm sure you're making more power with those cams than I am. What happened to the diffs? Bearings went or something else?

Sent from my Venue 8 3830 using Tapatalk

I first swapped in an e30 2.93 LSD which wore out the clutches in about 2 years... I replaced it with a 3.15 Torsen LSD which has developed a bad "clunk" and has lots of play on the right side. Both were used with unknown original miles, so both were a crap shoot as far as how long they would last and neither cost me much at all...

I am now rebuilding a 3.46 LSD from an e28 to be (I hope) the last diff I install...

I also just finished my 2nd swap project, a stock S50 into the twin ti, and kept the Getrag. I used the UUC 11.5 lb flywheel/e34 M5 clutch combo on this setup, and it is still attached to the small case 3.45 LSD that came on the car originally, which will need to be upgraded soon as well...

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackBMWs (Post 381313)

Time to change your signature Dave to a 328ti. :) Nicely done. :cool:

Done. Thanks!

Quote:

Originally Posted by anassa (Post 381328)

Kind of late to the thread, but good to see the wheels being put to good use! From canyon to track, where it belongs!

Nice with the swap too! Good work!

Yeah, I'm very happy with how the 15s turned out. Thanks!

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolferj (Post 381429)

Quoting this as it is very good information...

I first swapped in an e30 2.93 LSD which wore out the clutches in about 2 years... I replaced it with a 3.15 Torsen LSD which has developed a bad "clunk" and has lots of play on the right side. Both were used with unknown original miles, so both were a crap shoot as far as how long they would last and neither cost me much at all...

I am now rebuilding a 3.46 LSD from an e28 to be (I hope) the last diff I install...

I also just finished my 2nd swap project, a stock S50 into the twin ti, and kept the Getrag. I used the UUC 11.5 lb flywheel/e34 M5 clutch combo on this setup, and it is still attached to the small case 3.45 LSD that came on the car originally, which will need to be upgraded soon as well...

Interesting that the torsen developed a clunk, I hadn't really read about any issues with those. Too bad because the 3.46 torsen came on some Z3s.

Nice, I really want to find a 3.46 clutch type to rebuild. Based on running the smaller 15" tire, 3.46 would put me where I want in terms of top end on some of the longer tracks. That being said, the 3.73 with the M52 is pretty fun to drive, we'll see where it tops out on the straights.

Feeling the difference with just the M52, I can only imagine the S50/52 swaps are pretty awesome. I wouldn't mind doing S52 cams/M50 manifold at some point...

Just catching up. Great stuff Dave.

Did you eliminate the AC? Are you running a stock E36 6 cylinder pusher fan as well? If not, are you able to idle in traffic with just the unshrouded Spal?

How does it compare to your Coupe?

Yes, AC is currently eliminated and it has been a healthy 97-100F here all week... apparently the "feels like" temp today was 115F, with plenty of humidity.

I drove the ti to work today, I do have a new appreciation for AC.

I do not have a pusher fan, only the spal puller fan. I drove the car quite a bit in traffic and on the highway and the fan never had any issues keeping temps in check.

I spent a few afternoons fabbing some radiator ducting that forces all air coming in the lower bumper opening through the radiator. This was in preparation for a track day this weekend, first one with the m52.

So far, around 98F ambient according to the obc, the torque app shows coolant temps staying between 197-199F and going up to 204F in traffic.

I don't think the fan has actually kicked on since I added the duct. I'll try to make it turn on tomorrow.

I would say it accelerates better than the z3 but that's with the 3.73 in the ti vs the 3.07 in the z. The m54 is a very smooth motor with the dual Vanos and Disa. M52 definitely more raw.

Quote:

Originally Posted by spidertri (Post 380475)

It was about this time that I had to prep my Z3 to make the trek to Charlotte, NC for the annual Schuh Syndikat meet. The coupe needed front wheel bearings and I had some different front springs and bumpstops to install. So the M52 was put on the back burner while I worked on the Z.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7441/...5480458c_k.jpg

Schuh syndikat was a blast, there were 16 coupes that showed up for the group photo and several other roadsters. The real treat of the weekend was Ed McKernan (bimmerbum) driving his 318ti clubsport all the way from Florida to meet up at Schuh Syndikat. All BMWs are welcome to the event, it is Z3 coupe centric, but it’s a great group of enthusiasts who enjoy the “quirkier” BMW models. Ed’s clubsport has a bunch of Dinan parts and it was really cool to see him representing at the meet. I heard he was hounding the M coupes pretty good on the twisty prelude drive…

Missed this on my first pass through the thread on my phone. Late to the party I know. Schuh is always worth the drive, great to see you again Dave. I'm headed back up that way again next month for ZFEST.

Those are really good temp numbers. The bone stock E36 M3 I refreshed a few years ago would creep up to 212 in traffic. My Coupe stays around 199-204 (and gets as low as 173 on the highway) but it has no mechanical fan, a fluidyne radiator and the Stewart pump.

The ducting you did is key, I suspect better ducting is a better upgrade than a better radiator.

You're making me want to swap the Clubsport, something I should have done while it sat in pieces for 4 years. I even have an aluminum block M52 with S50 cams ready to go...

http://www.angelfire.com/de3/bimmert...amsheaders.JPG

Quote:

Originally Posted by spidertri (Post 381525)

Need to put together my video from Summit Shenandoah but the car felt fantastic. No issues with 2.5hrs on track.

I didn't have any pre-swap data, so no comparison but the extra power really feels great, no issues with breaking traction on the 205/50-15 maxxis.

Temps on track stayed around 205 until I'd head in after a session, then they would creep up to 210 and the fan would kick on. I'm guessing if I ran a 80c tstat the temps would be lower but so far I don't see any reason to swap it out.

Stock E36 M3s will creep up to 214 in traffic. I also think you're just fine.

Quote:

Originally Posted by spidertri (Post 381895)

Video from Dominion raceway back in October. I didn't make it to many events this year but I really enjoy the extra power from the M52. Over the winter and next season I want to get my TT license and build the car to TTE.

https://youtu.be/IuZ4mHT8lBo

Hard to believe the last time I posted was in 2016. TTE build didn't happen, I suppose life has gotten in the way a bit, which certainly hasn't been a bad thing. I made it out to VIR and Dominion last year and a few local autox. The car is just so much fun to drive I haven't had the desire to change much.

The one change I did make in 2017 was swapping from the 3.73 rear diff to a 3.07 torsen. I wanted to get some of the top end back and see if the torsen would better apply the power along with the trailing arm rear end. So far it has been a worthy change.

Fast forward to this year. Car is currently down getting refreshed front TCK struts, 550lb front springs, offset FCABs, 300mm front rotors, 38mm rear calipers, and some other maintenance.

As much as I'd love to go to bigger front rotors and vented rear rotors, I enjoy the feel of the car on the shorter 15" tires. So these brake upgrades will fit under those wheels.

I run RBF600 fluid and PFC08 pads. My upgrade will change the brake bias from the stock 66.6% to 62.6%. This means it will ask the rear brakes to do a little more work, hopefully that won't be an issue. Stock E36 M3 bias is 61.2% and Z3M bias is 60%.

The front spring rate change is going from current 650lb springs to 550lb springs. This is to try and get the suspension frequency back into a good place. Running 650/700 was nice on track to put power down but driving the car over bumps was miserable as the response of the rear was too close to the same frequency as the front. This, as well as really old struts, made the ride bouncy.

I've also picked up a M50 manifold and adapter kit. Keeping my eyes peeled for some S52 cams to get a nice little 25hp bump with a retune from Markert Motorworks. Those changes will probably happen this fall after I blow my car budget on all the stuff right now.:wink:

I'd love to see some pictures of your radiator ducting. I'm planning to do the same thing for my car, and some inspiration would be great.

Yeah I'll try to get some pictures next time the bumper is off.

There are other pics around the web but I just used some galvanized sheet from Lowe's to direct all air from the bumper to the radiator. Then made sure the air couldn't find a way around the sides of the radiator and patched up any areas in the stock shrouding that were weak.

Quote:

Originally Posted by spidertri (Post 380870)

.

There are many options available to run a hose to the expansion tank but I wanted to delete the throttle body heater and retain the heater core. I chose to stick with the stock M52 hard pipe and use the connections I needed.

Why delete the throttle body heater?? Is it not necessary??

I'm in the middle of my m52 swap right now and my ti is going to be a track car. Plus I live in SoCal. I want to delete and simplify as much stuff as possible. If the throttle body heater lines are not necessary then that's TWO water lines I could get rid of and not have to worry about leaking!! :biggrin::biggrin:

I'm guessing these lines help to heat up the throttle body/inlet air temp quicker when it's cold??? Since I live in SoCal and it NEVER technically gets cold here, I should be able to delete it with no issues right?