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Old 03-07-2018, 12:24 PM   #1
Johjamkep
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Default Has anybody modified ASC software to keep abs but delete traction control?

Any input is appreciated.


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Old 03-07-2018, 03:37 PM   #2
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Not sure what you are trying to accomplish, but I haven't heard of this.

The easy way is to buy the delete intake boot, remove the module if you choose to, and pull the bulb in the cluster.
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Old 03-07-2018, 04:29 PM   #3
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Remove the asc throttle choke valve but keep the electric actuator plugged in. You will have the asc light on but still have abs. Then if you want you can remove the asc bulb from the cluster.
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Old 03-08-2018, 12:29 PM   #4
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Thanks. I like the idea of having abs on my daily driver but only if I can eliminate traction control. I am close to doing my swap and would like to have this figured out by the time I do. If I cannot make it function the way I want, then I will likely remove the system altogether while the engine is out.


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Old 03-08-2018, 04:05 PM   #5
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Thanks. I like the idea of having abs on my daily driver but only if I can eliminate traction control. I am close to doing my swap and would like to have this figured out by the time I do. If I cannot make it function the way I want, then I will likely remove the system altogether while the engine is out.
I bought my '98 from Minnesota back in January and drove it all the way to California with serious snow most of the way. It was riding on Blizzaks, and I'm very impressed with how well it performed.

I've done traction control development for Dinan Motorsports, and typically find street car systems very intrusive. Not having to deal with emissions, I've used ignition or fuel cuts for torque reduction, as the throttle actuator isn't as accurate. However, since that drive, I've actually spoken to some of my old colleagues about this system and why we feel like it performs so well. In the end, its lack of sophistication is its genius - its not using an accelerometer, yaw-sensor or steering position sensor to predict intended drive path, which ends up making it feel much more natural.

Combined with the diff control, its just too good for me to want to get rid of it all the time. Instead, I think it would be interesting to build a little arduino kit to reverse the logic so its by default off when you start the car, and on when you need it. It would be simple to use a small switching relay to change the cluster logic so the light came on only when TC was on instead of off.

I had a quick look at the wiring diagram, and this is relatively easy - and wouldn't cost too much. The indicator light is a simple low-side drive, and the switch signal is a momentary 12V, so this could all be done right at the ASC module.

I'd have to figure out the Ardunio so that it automatically sends a momentary high-signal when the car is started, but that's easy as the ASC module has inputs that are hot in run/start only. Maybe I'll give this a shot over the new few months and let you all know how it goes.

Cheers,
Neel
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Old 03-08-2018, 06:55 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apexspeedtech View Post
I bought my '98 from Minnesota back in January and drove it all the way to California with serious snow most of the way. It was riding on Blizzaks, and I'm very impressed with how well it performed.



I've done traction control development for Dinan Motorsports, and typically find street car systems very intrusive. Not having to deal with emissions, I've used ignition or fuel cuts for torque reduction, as the throttle actuator isn't as accurate. However, since that drive, I've actually spoken to some of my old colleagues about this system and why we feel like it performs so well. In the end, its lack of sophistication is its genius - its not using an accelerometer, yaw-sensor or steering position sensor to predict intended drive path, which ends up making it feel much more natural.



Combined with the diff control, its just too good for me to want to get rid of it all the time. Instead, I think it would be interesting to build a little arduino kit to reverse the logic so its by default off when you start the car, and on when you need it. It would be simple to use a small switching relay to change the cluster logic so the light came on only when TC was on instead of off.



I had a quick look at the wiring diagram, and this is relatively easy - and wouldn't cost too much. The indicator light is a simple low-side drive, and the switch signal is a momentary 12V, so this could all be done right at the ASC module.



I'd have to figure out the Ardunio so that it automatically sends a momentary high-signal when the car is started, but that's easy as the ASC module has inputs that are hot in run/start only. Maybe I'll give this a shot over the new few months and let you all know how it goes.



Cheers,

Neel


I had this same thought this morning, minus the immediate technical know-how. I donít know what an arduino is but a slightly delayed voltage signal tapped into the switch could do it. If you are willing to pursue it, please let me know and feel free to message me here or email at john.k@mikejohnsimports.com. Thank you!!


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Old 03-09-2018, 05:31 PM   #7
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Turning off the ASC with ignition-on was not an unknown mode some years ago.

I think the simplest way was to generate a pulse with a resistor capacitor pair: tie one side of the capacitor to 12V, one side of the resistor to ground, and the other sides of both to each other and to the ABS/ASC controller's ASC switch input.
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Old 03-09-2018, 05:42 PM   #8
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Default all about time

Quote:
I had this same thought this morning, minus the immediate technical know-how. I donít know what an arduino is but a slightly delayed voltage signal tapped into the switch could do it. If you are willing to pursue it, please let me know and feel free to message me here or email at john.k@mikejohnsimports.com. Thank you!!
For me, its just about having the time to do it. An Ardunio is a cheap little open-source microcontroller that we can use to invert the button presses. They can be less than $10. I think this is the logic we need:

Upon +12V ignition (key in "run" position,) have a short dealy (3 seconds?) then send a pulse exactly as if someone pressed the button. at the same time, you use a small relay to make the light on the dash ON when its currently OFF, and vice-versa.

Changing the wiring and installing the relay is a 15min job. For someone who knows what they're doing, programming the Ardunio is a 5 min job.

So what you're telling me is I have to get off my ass and get that Ardunio for Dummys book I've been avoiding.....
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Old 03-10-2018, 04:59 AM   #9
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More back to the OP's subject, I would think it might be possible to recode the ABS module to tell it that it didn't have traction control. Or, at worst, swap the ABS module for one from a car without it.
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Old 03-10-2018, 07:46 AM   #10
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That depends on whether these were among the design requirements. Given how cost-conscience the automotive makers were (and are), I would not expect that, but would be happy to be mistaken.

You can check the swap idea quickly enough by comparing the wiring of the two systems in the Electrical Troubleshoot Manuals.
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Old 03-11-2018, 02:14 PM   #11
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Default ABS recode

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Originally Posted by John Firestone View Post
That depends on whether these were among the design requirements. Given how cost-conscience the automotive makers were (and are), I would not expect that, but would be happy to be mistaken.

You can check the swap idea quickly enough by comparing the wiring of the two systems in the Electrical Troubleshoot Manuals.
Iím looking at some wiring diagrams, and am a little confused: Did 1995-1997 cars with Traction Control not have an auxiliary throttle actuator? Thereís not one listed on the ABS/AST 1995-1997 318ti w/Traction Control wiring diagram Iím looking at.

Iíve never known these Conti-Teves MK20 ABS to be flash-able with custom firmware; by contrast there are a handful who can with the newer MK60s from E46ís. However, it appears pin 14 is the ASC switch and 12 is the ASC Lamp, so it would be very easy to create a ďdisable all timesĒ setup.

-Neel
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Old 03-12-2018, 12:20 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by apexspeedtech View Post
Iím looking at some wiring diagrams, and am a little confused: Did 1995-1997 cars with Traction Control not have an auxiliary throttle actuator? Thereís not one listed on the ABS/AST 1995-1997 318ti w/Traction Control wiring diagram Iím looking at.

Iíve never known these Conti-Teves MK20 ABS to be flash-able with custom firmware; by contrast there are a handful who can with the newer MK60s from E46ís. However, it appears pin 14 is the ASC switch and 12 is the ASC Lamp, so it would be very easy to create a ďdisable all timesĒ setup.

-Neel
Just to be clear, I wasn't suggesting custom firmware. Often times modules can be coded for different equipment such as an engine module that could be coded for manual or automatic trans, sometimes ABS or not, etc.
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Old 03-18-2018, 11:51 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by Johjamkep View Post
Thanks. I like the idea of having abs on my daily driver but only if I can eliminate traction control. I am close to doing my swap and would like to have this figured out by the time I do. If I cannot make it function the way I want, then I will likely remove the system altogether while the engine is out.


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Pull the throttle body, disconnect the cable from the actuator, keep the actuator and the tps plugged in - no error codes, not light, abs is non-the-wiser.

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