Trade a '90 Miata for a '96 Ti?

[ellcapitan]

Hi, it's me again. I'm now considering trading my '90 Silverstone B-pkg, 5-speed Miata, which is in absolute mint original condition, with 50K miles, for a '96 base 5-speed Ti, with 99K miles, that also appears to be in very clean original condition. It would be an even trade. What do you guys think? Am I crazy? (I know the Miata.net folks will think so!)

[mohaughn]

The Ti is probably worth between 3 and maybe 5k at most. What is the Miata worth?

Both of them are old cars, and it will more than likely come down to what you want. If you are tired of the Miata, go for it. I would probably stay with the Miata as I perceive them to have less issues than the Ti. They are basically the same speed, the Ti might have a little bit nicer interior, but at the end of the day, they are both older cars.

[lazoh]

You will get a bench seat in tha back that can technically seat 3 if you get the ti. You will also get "status", it is a BMW

[ellcapitan]

They are both worth roughly the same. The main difference being, the Miata is (believe it or not) climbing in value ever so slightly, and the Ti is falling.

I don't currently own one, and I've always wanted a BMW. (To me, Minis don't count.) I'm just not prepared to do big bucks to buy--and big bucks to maintain--a newer one. Since clean E30s are becoming too old and too scarce, the Ti seems to be the answer. My biggest question is, will I still be happy with a Ti once the novelty of the "BMW-ness" wears off...having owned a Miata? I kinda always figured that the inline-6 was the heart and soul of a BMW. So, with the 4-banger, is there more to these cars that will keep me entertained long term? (I'm just a natural skeptic, and I don't want to feel like I may eventually come to regret off-loading the Miata...and, FWIW, I could care less about the convertible-factor.) ALSO, the car I'm looking at has about 99K miles. Is there a big 100K service that will immediately be due (by the time I get it home, LOL), that I need to be concerned with, cost-wise? Is there anything that is likely already shot on the car (shocks, bushings, etc.)?

[pnosker]

I don't think that's too crazy. Miatas are incredible in Autocross, but a well prepped Ti can be competitive too.

Otherwise, it's a similar car but with more room, a top that won't leak, and is probably pretty similar to maintain.

Mohaughn, what issues are you thinking of? I haven't had any reliability problems other than the standard rubber hose issues that plague most older cars, and a ball joint issue on my old 98 ti.

Before 120k you will probably have to replace the plastic pieces that are common (two plastic coolant pieces attached to the block), change fluids all over, and O2 sensors as well as rubber intake hoses. Otherwise, there's not really much you have to do except flush coolant. The M44 is a very reliable engine if you do the required maintenance. It's much cheaper to maintain than the 6 cylinders. 6 cyls can have Vanos issues, etc. that are not found on the 4 cylinder.

[roadrash]

Random thoughts...

• If the 4 cyl. isn't enough for you, there are plenty of options to swap a 6 cyl. into the 318ti.
• My mechanic suggested replacing the radiator and several other parts of the cooling system at 100K
• Since you said that you won't miss the convertible, my guess is that you'll love having all the space in the back seat and cargo area of the 318ti. If the 318ti you're looking at has a sunroof (most do), you'll probably be satisfied by that.
• The 318ti probably has a quieter cabin since it's not a 'vert.
• If you've done your own maintenance on the Miata, there will probably be a learning curve for working on the 318ti but it's doable. Also, if you end up taking the 318ti to a mechanic for something that you'd have done yourself on the Miata, that will make the 318ti SEEM more expensive to maintain.
• And finally... I briefly test-drove a Miata before I bought my 318ti. I think I made the right choice. Granted, the car I was replacing was an '89 Civic Si and the BMW is very similar to the Honda in features and configuration, so I was a bit biased towards the hatchback. The 318ti seems to be just as much fun as the Miata, but a lot more practical.

I suggest that you try to trade cars on a trial basis, for 3-5 days so you have a chance to make an educated decision.

Good luck!

[spidertri]

Oh man, I'd love a clean NA. If yours is in that good of condition I think you should hang on to it. I've ridden in a really well set up NA and it was amazing, I'm not sure if the ti could get to that level for the same amount of money.

The mods (if your into that) are going to be more plentiful for the miata since it has such a strong following, the ti typically gets neglected by tuning companies.

[cooljess76]

Originally Posted by ellcapitan

...the Miata is (believe it or not) climbing in value ever so slightly, and the Ti is falling.

I'm not sure where you got this little tidbit of information from. Maybe in your own internet circle of Mazda enthusiasts, but in the real world a Mazda is a Mazda and a Bimmer is a Bimmer. Pound for pound the 318ti has held it's value better than any e36 including the M3. That's not saying much considering they sell every day for between 2k-6k. While the Miata is by no means a collector's car, it does have a similar following as the 318ti making them desirable to only a very select crowd. Both are fun little cars, but at the end of the day they're only worth what someone is willing to spend and it'll be a cold day in hell before either car is worth as much/more than it was new. Try finding the highly desired '95 clubsport(only 300 made) or a '96+ 318ti sport with a manual tranny unmolested and in decent condition, then try to find a Miata with similar features. For every 10 Miatas you find, you might see 1 318ti that fits the bill. That being said, the 318ti is not a rare car either, just less common than Miatas. Most people don't even know what a 318ti is and/or probably never seen one in person. If you haven't already done so, I'd highly recommend driving one. If you like Miatas, you'll love the 318ti. Best of luck in your search

[ellcapitan]

I would never expect that either car will ever regain enough value to ever come close to their cost when new. Very very few modern cars ever gain any value at all. But the fact remains that I can sell my car for slightly more today than I could a few years ago...and that's with the recession! Early NAs' rock bottom seems to have come and gone. Of course, the trick is, it's gotta be a clean example. A trashed Miata is...well, trash. Conversely, unless the Ti's unusual (for a BMW) reliability catches on with a lot more people, its unlikely even clean examples will ever appreciate in value. Of course, certain extremely rare versions, like the '95 Club Sport mentioned, will always fetch a premium, if well-preserved, to those who care about them (certainly not your average used car buyer, and not even you average BMW fan). Hell, until a couple of months ago I didn't even know what a Club Sport was...well, more acurately, I had forgotten what it was...and I'm usually really good at knowing this stuff. (Motor oil in my veins, I knew most cars' brand and model, that I saw on the road, by the age of 6.)

[wolferj-RIP]

I have both a Miata (NB) and a ti... both have great, fun features that are appealing, they are sporty, handle great and have a cache following. That said, an unmolested first year Miata would fetch a little more than a clean sport ti here in the SF bay area.

My problem is the Miata is just too small, both inside and outside. The ti fits me perfectly, like the ti was designed for me alone. The Miata make me conform to it and has very little room for adjustment...

I say go with your gut reaction when you have the opportunity to drive the ti, and definitely have the ti inspected by a certified BMW tech before you commit to the deal.

[tiFreak]

my dad used to have a '90 Miata with the B package in red, similar to yours to, really low mileage and super clean, he was going to give it to me in a few years but I told him it was a girls car and I didn't want it, so he sold it, I'm kicking myself for that

[spidertri]

My dad was going to give me his 1986 528e 5spd when I was old enough to drive, I told him I didn't want such an old, ugly car...I'd like to smack my 16yo self with a 2"x4".

[roadrash]

My dad co-signed the loan for my first car, and that was it. I had to make all payments including insurance, and pay for all repairs.

But, um... we're drifting severely off-topic here.

[ellcapitan]

Hahaha. The Miata (especially in red) looks like a girl's car, but drives like a man's car! I also agree that it "fits" like a "real" car that's been scaled down to about 7/8ths scale. All told, this Ti will have to blow me away with it's good condition for me to make the trade. Otherwise, I may try to fire-sale the Miata and grab the Ti anyway so that I can end up w/ some $$ in my pocket.

[spidertri]

Originally Posted by ellcapitan

Otherwise, I may try to fire-sale the Miata and grab the Ti anyway so that I can end up w/ some $$ in my pocket.

If you really don't want the miata anymore that would be the best way to do it.