10 speaker stereo

[Ji Money]

I've read a few discussion about the 10 speaker radio but I wanted to ask about my situation still.

I just bought my 318ti and it has the 10 speaker set but it has an aftermarket cd player installed by Circuit City. So a few people have said that just installing a new head unit will make the sound worse since you have to bypass the amp.

My question is, the original seller still has the original tape deck, but just the tape deck only. I thought I read that if you install another head unit, you would have to move the amp. Does this mean that Circuit City took the amp since the original owner only has the tape deck? I asked him to swap the head units because I wanted to use the 10 speakers and the high power amp, but now I'm not sure if it is possible to go back to the original 10 speaker setup using the factory amp.

[Tyler]

Well to see if you still have the amp in the car remove the rear driverside panel in your trunk and it should be right there in plane sight.

[Ji Money]

Ok, so if it is still there, then if I want the best sound with the current speaker setup, going back to the stock tape deck is best bet right?

[Ji Money]

All right, some more research seems to say that Circuit City may have tapped into the existing amp. I hope they did. The sound just doesn't seem balanced. I feel like the front sounds a lot louder, but I should check the cd player's front and rear balance first.

[Phil Marx]

Originally Posted by Ji Money

I feel like the front sounds a lot louder, but I should check the cd player's front and rear balance first.

Umm, yeah. And they're probably closer to your ears, too!!! The stock head unit sounds like crap. And, and I do mean any, after-market head unit is an improvement in sound quality. I'll try and find you a link since you must not be able to manage the search function by yourself: Factory head unit deficiencies

[Ji Money]

Originally Posted by Phil Marx

Umm, yeah. And they're probably closer to your ears, too!!! The stock head unit sounds like crap. And, and I do mean any, after-market head unit is an improvement in sound quality. I'll try and find you a link since you must not be able to manage the search function by yourself: Factory head unit deficiencies

Ok ok, I should have used the search feature. I just read somewhere in the I.C.E. forum that using an after-market head unit can make the sound worse because you have to bypass the amp which has the cross-over or something. Anyway, I've decided to keep the Kenwood CD player, it has mid range controls which is nice.

I was sitting in my 318ti today and playing with the different bass, mids, and trebel settings seem to help balance the sound. Maybe the bass being so low made the front tweeters stand out more. This car has been sitting in my driveway since Sunday. My check finally cleared and the title should be in the mail soon. I can't wait to drive it. The manual says that you shouldn't start the car and leave it idle and let the engine warm up. I think thats the end of the stereo sessions for now.

[pnosker]

Well, the main deficiency of the tape teck (Applies to C33 and earlier) is that it compresses signals coming from FM and Tape (but not CD) down to 12k hz and lower, from what I've read. I have a Sirius tuner and a USASpec iPod adpater hooked up to my CD Changer input and it sounds better than my old Kenwood iPod setup running through that cd-input. Also the speakers are a little weak on bass, so I added a subwoofer (6.5" Bazooka tube).

[SporTi]

In my car the previous BOZO stereo installers simply bypassed the amp/crossover by splicing two wires on one side into one on the other (i.e. they took the left rear single wire where it went into the amp and crimped it to both the woofer and tweeter feeds for the left rear.) I would assume that I am getting less than optimum sound this way. Should I build a board of crossovers back there? One for each corner? Also, why can't you run a new head unit through the original amp/crossover? I would think that you would just increase your power.

[pnosker]

What they did sounds like they created an imedance mismatch. I'm surprised the system doesn't sound like crap.

[Ji Money]

I hope Circuit City did not do that crimping stuff. The stereo sounds decent now after playing with the bass, mids, and trebel.

[mohaughn]

Originally Posted by SporTi

In my car the previous BOZO stereo installers simply bypassed the amp/crossover by splicing two wires on one side into one on the other (i.e. they took the left rear single wire where it went into the amp and crimped it to both the woofer and tweeter feeds for the left rear.) I would assume that I am getting less than optimum sound this way. Should I build a board of crossovers back there? One for each corner? Also, why can't you run a new head unit through the original amp/crossover? I would think that you would just increase your power.

If you are keeping all of the stock speakers you can keep the stock amp without to many problems. The main issue with aftermarket headunits is their output to amp voltage. As the stock amp is hardwired to accept the signal from the stock amp it does not have a gain control. The main purpose of gain control on an amplifier is to set the amplifier at the proper sensitivity so that you are not generating noise and distortion.

So let's say that the stock headunit as a 3volt signal, and your new headunit has a 4.5volt signal. That 4.5volt signal will cause noise and distortion when you start to crank the radio up. Where as if you have an aftermarket stereo you can simply turn down the gain on the amplifier to accomodate the higher output voltage of the head unit.

[Ji Money]

Originally Posted by mohaughn

If you are keeping all of the stock speakers you can keep the stock amp without to many problems. The main issue with aftermarket headunits is their output to amp voltage. As the stock amp is hardwired to accept the signal from the stock amp it does not have a gain control. The main purpose of gain control on an amplifier is to set the amplifier at the properly sensitivity so that you are not generating noise and distortion.

So let's say that the stock headunit as a 3volt signal, and your new headunit has a 4.5volt signal. That 4.5volt signal will cause noise and distortion when you start to crank the radio up. Where as if you have an aftermarket stereo you can simply turn down the gain on the amplifier to accomodate the higher output voltage of the head unit.

So the stock amp does not have gain controls, but the new head unit may have them. If the head unit is connected to the amp correctly, you are not using the head unit's built in amp right? I remeber doing that with an adapter when I swapped out the stereo on a 93 Nissan Maxima but still keeping the amp and speakers for the Bose system.

[mohaughn]

It totally depends on how you plug it all in. Most consumer level car headunits do not have an adjustable amp pre-out. It will be at one voltage and that is it... Now high end competition head units may have adjustable amp pre-out voltages. My Clarion Pro-audio unit is 5volts and that is it. No gain control.

You can use a line level converter or controller. In some cases a headunit does not have a pre-amp output. In those cases you can take the amplified output, run it through a line level converter and it will drop it back down to the proper voltage range. Most good line level converters also have the ability to make slight changes to the output voltage, which is essentially a gain control. You could also use a line level converter to use the stock headunit with an aftermarket amplifier.

They are all work arounds in my opinion. As the stock system is designed, and not that well, to work with the stock headunit, amplifier, and speakers changing any one components is not going to give you a good sound. The best way to get good sound is to gut it all and start over.

[Ji Money]

Yeah, maybe I'll swap out everything one day.

[scabzzzz]

Originally Posted by Ji Money

Ok ok, I should have used the search feature. I just read somewhere in the I.C.E. forum that using an after-market head unit can make the sound worse because you have to bypass the amp which has the cross-over or something. Anyway, I've decided to keep the Kenwood CD player, it has mid range controls which is nice.

I was sitting in my 318ti today and playing with the different bass, mids, and trebel settings seem to help balance the sound. Maybe the bass being so low made the front tweeters stand out more. This car has been sitting in my driveway since Sunday. My check finally cleared and the title should be in the mail soon. I can't wait to drive it. The manual says that you shouldn't start the car and leave it idle and let the engine warm up. I think thats the end of the stereo sessions for now.

keep in mind you have a 10 speakers soud system but its nothing but high and mid range. this is the WORST feature of a ti in my opinion. i mean, the only real bass you have is coming from the kick panels by your feet. thats ridiculous. so yeah, you're going to need at least a small like 8inch or 10inch sub in the hatch the balance it all out.