My Manual Transmission Swap!

[CirrusSR22]

Thanks! When I had the rear in the air, the wheel would spin with the clutch fully depressed and in gear. So it's dragging a bit. Also, I can put the car in first, press the clutch and the car will start without any extra effort, so it's not dragging too much. The pedal effort feels firm and smooth. My guess is one of the cylinders just isn't allowing full pressure.... or I sure hope!

I'll add that I didn't get a Check Engine Light which I was expecting. I thougth OBDII cars would get a CEL plus the transmission light. I got just the transmission light (pulled the bulb). A pleasant surprise!

[angel318ti]

take the slave of the transmission and bleed that by hand. It is possible that it might be sticking.

[CirrusSR22]

I tried that as well. My procedure was to hook a clear hose to the bleed valve, open it and pump the pedal many times until the fluid ran without bubbles. I made sure the reservoir was very full the entire time. Then I unbolted the slave, positioned the bleed valve at the top, cracked the valve (with the hose attached) and pressed the piston in, then closed the valve. Then I slowly released the piston and repeated about 10 times.

I even went back and did the entire process about 5 times.

Do you think it would help to press the clutch pedal, keep it down, then close the valve? Release the pedal and repeat? I did it the way I bleed brakes which is to open the bleed valve with a hose attached, and pump numerous times in a row until it runs without bubbles.

[angel318ti]

No. you need to pump repeatedly with the valve closed. If you keep pumping with the valve open you are sucking in air and it will never bleed the system properly. Close the valve pump about 10 to 15 times. Hold the pedal down, open the valve and immediately close it before depressing the pedal. You can add the clear hose to the end of the valve but only to catch the fluid that will come out.

[CirrusSR22]

I've always been keeping a clear hose and catch bottle (placed higher than the bleed valve) attached every time I open the bleed valve, so air definitely isn't coming in the bleed valve.

Tomorrow I'll try holding the pedal down, opening and then closing the bleed valve, then releasing the pedal. Thanks for the tips!! How frustrating to get this far, and have everything go quite smoothly then get stuck a trivial little thing like a few air bubbles

EDIT: This procedure looks interesting. I think I'll buy an oil squirt can and give it a try too
http://www.bmpdesign.com/technical/t...eed_clutch.php
http://www.dietersmotorsports.com/te...h_bleeding.htm

[dguzzardo22]

very nice!! we need more of this !!



still intrested ! in any left over parts !?!?!

[CirrusSR22]

Still no luck! I've bled it every possible way. Standard, a way the dealer suggested, the "reverse bleed" and now a pressure bleed. Still won't go into gear...... Any air HAS to out by now.

I found a BMW bulletin which describes this and it still narrows down to the clutch, but most likely a dry, sticky clutch disc (sliding motion). I used the grease packet included with the Sachs kits, but there was barely anything in the packet. Just a super tiny amount. Figured Sachs would know what they were doing.

Anyhow, I'm gonna pull the transmission and use more of the special Unriex S2 grease BMW specifies in the bulletin. Also I will check the runout of the clutch disc itself.

I did the procedure below and Diagnosis #1 matches perfectly.

Situation:
Transmission may be difficult to shift especially first gear engagement and/or gear shift linkage is binding.
Note: Field observations have indicated that a transmission which is difficult to shift (especially into first gear) is primarily a clutch related problem and only in isolated cases a failure in the transmission itself.

Procedure:
If the above customer complaint is received the following diagnostic tips will assist in troubleshooting a clutch, gear shift linkage or transmission problem.
Verify the customer complaint:
Note: Engage the parking brake and assure that no people or objects are in the vehicle's path.

• Run the engine at idle speed
• Press the clutch pedal to the floor
• From the neutral stick shift position engage first gear
If first gear is difficult to engage, hold the stick shift at the resistance point (approximately half of the total stick shift travel) with constant force.
Then switch the ignition off with the other hand.

Diagnosis 1:
If first gear now engages completely, i.e. the stick shift moves to the end position without any additional pressure applied, there is a problem in the clutch system.
Explanation:
Because the clutch does not uncouple completely, a residual torque is transmitted to the transmission input shaft when the engine is running. This inhibits the release and meshing of the sliding sleeve, in the transmission, at the end of the synchronization process.
Turning the engine off relieves the input shaft of this torque thus simulating a completely uncoupled clutch.
Diagnosis 2:
If the stick shift remains at the resistance point, there is a problem in the external gear shift linkage or in the transmission.

Cause:
Diagnosis 1:
Possible causes for a clutch problem as per Diagnosis 1 above are:

• Input shaft taper splines not lubricated properly / grease dried out.
• Clutch disc difficult to move on transmission input shaft.
• Clutch disc wobble.
• Air in the hydraulic system of clutch mechanism.
• Release bearing defective or difficult to move on the guide sleeve.
• Clutch disc or pressure plate broken / worn out.

Diagnosis 2:
Possible causes for gear shift linkage binding and/or internal transmission problems as per Diagnosis 2 above:

• External gearshift linkage binding (shift rod joints stiff).
• Stick shift bellows boot incorrectly installed (positioned too high or too low on the stick shift lever).
• Sound deadening between the outer gear shift linkage and the body incorrectly installed and/or distorted.
Possible causes inside of the transmission:

• Faulty synchronization.
• Internal gear shift linkage binding.
• Water in the transmission fluid. (rare)


Correction:
Diagnosis 1:

• Remove the transmission.
• Remove and/or inspect the pressure plate, clutch disc and release bearing. (Replace components if necessary.)
Note: The plastic sliding sleeve which the clutch release bearing slides on should never be lubricated since the grease will allow the clutch wear particles and other contamination to build up and cause an increase in clutch pedal effort.
See Service Information bulletin 21 01 94 for further information.
• Carefully clean the transmission input shaft (tapered splines and guide section of shaft).
• Using a paint brush, apply a thin coating of "Esso UNIREX S2" grease on the transmission input shaft (tapered splines and guide section of the shaft).
Note: "Esso UNIREX S2" taper spline grease was phased into production approximately 4/98 and replaces "Microlube GL261 BMW" grease. The new grease has proven to be more resistant to lubrication breakdown under all operating conditions and is available under BMW part number 83 23 9 416 138.
Only use "Esso UNIREX S2" taper spline grease when repairs become necessary which involve the cleaning and lubrication of the transmission input shaft.
• Reinstall the transmission.
For additional information on troubleshooting the clutch refer to the repair manual section 2190.
Diagnosis 2:

• Carefully inspect the gear shift linkage areas described in Diagnosis 2 section above. Repair as necessary.
• If the gear shift linkage is functioning properly without binding the cause is an internal fault in the transmission.
Note: If the transmission is replaced due to an internal fault, using a paint brush apply a thin coating of "Esso UNIREX S2" grease on the transmission input shaft (tapered splines and guide section of the shaft) before installing the new transmission.

[CirrusSR22]

So I got the transmission back off today. It only took 2 hours! to get the car in the air and remove absolutely everything. Of course the dealer didn't get the UnirexS2 grease in this morning like they said it would be

I checked the runout of the clutch disc and it was about .020" and I got it back to under .010" using some light hammer taps. I also checked the throwout fork which is still good. That thing is so solid I highly doubt it would ever crack.

When I get it all back together I'll report back.

*** A tip I've learned pulling the transmission twice now *** When you get the transmission off, thoroughly brush the starter alignment pin with a wire brush (a found an old .22 metal bore brush which worked well for the starter pin bore.) Also I used a fine grit sandpaper for the pin itself which is attached to the transmission. Apply a coating of anti-sieze on the pin and the bore. This will greatly help installation and future removal of the starter.

[CirrusSR22]

Still no good, even after installing a new clutch soft/flex hose!

To summarize:
Didn't work on a new clutch with old hydraulics.

Didn't work on a new clutch with new hydraulics.

Didn't work on a new clutch, new hydraulics, properly lubed input spline, perfectly straight clutch disc, and a not bent, not cracked release fork.

---------------

My final guess is that the pressure plate I got as part of a brand new Sachs kit is faulty. I found a post or two on bf.c of people who had that happen. If that's not it? Part the f'er out and buy an E46?

[vap3]

damn sorry to hear that your swap didn't go too well, i guess i'll just run my e36 auto m44 to the ground and save up for a e46 5spd 6 cylinder, only one second slower than the m3! to 60 mph

[CirrusSR22]

I have a new throwout bearing, pressure plate, clutch pivot and spring clip coming today and tomorrow. Each part was already brand new, but I figure the pivot and clip are cheap, and I can then rule out the pressure plate and throwout bearing. I also have a new release fork coming to try. I reused the old one, but thoroughly inspected it and it's definitely not cracked or damaged. Time to pull the trans one more time!

[yoda]

Cirrus,
Your somewhat bad luck with the whole thing might turn me off of doing my swap... Not that I already have all the stuff to do it, but I am seriously thinking about it... I have this nagging voice in my head telling me to get rid of the Auto tranny!....
Some how I though it would be much easier than what you have described in the process though... and your current issues with the clutch and whatnot...
Man I seriously hope you get it figured out and that it turns out it was something not related to installation or swap, but a faulty part!...

[CirrusSR22]

I wouldn't let it turn you off to the swap. It really is a stright-forward process. One one hand I hope the pressure plate is the issue so I can finally have a working car. On the other, I'm still pissed that it has taken so much time and money. I think mine was just a fluke, really. Thankfully my parents have a beater car that they have let me use for the past couple weeks.

There is only a finite number of parts involved here (about 10, for the clutch itself), so once everything is new, installed properly, triple checked, greased thoroughly, and bled over and over, it has to be a defective part. I have a feeling the pressure plate would be sensitive to a drop on concrete, so maybe that's it?

[tiFreak]

bad luck, but it will be worth it to have a proper car

[CirrusSR22]

Fixed!!!!

The BRAND NEW Sachs pressure plate was bad. --> Sachs <-- The friction surface and main body of the pressure plate were not on the same plane. So, it had a warp/wobble and that must have kept a small portion of the friction surface from pulling away when the clutch was disenaged. That explains the dragging clutch. I'll post pictures later to show the issue. It's not something you would notice unless you were really looking for it. Compared to the new one though, the difference was noticeable. Gonna go drive it now

Well I wasted $500 or so and two+ weeks of my life trying to figure this out. At least I have a running car.